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Windows 7 Runtimes?

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:02 am
by bphlpt
Ive just started using Win7 so I'm very new to it, therefore, please forgive what might be a very stupid question. Is there any need for a Windows 7 Runtime Pack? I've seen CPL packs and Uber Packs but no Runtime. Of course .NET is included already, except .NET 4, but what about the "Other Runtimes"? I've been using RougeSpear's and Kel's packs for years, not at the smae time, but I've seen no mention of whether either of them are compatible with Win7. I've torn through both of their latest and come up with one I THINK would work and would be glad to share it, but I hate to embarass myself if there's no need and I'm wasting my time. And I don't want to step on any toes if anyone else already has a pack out there. If you would like to see mine let me know - I would absolutely LOVE someone with more experience to give me some feedback.

Cheers and Regards

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:13 am
by jaynbe
Most of essential runtimes, like VC8 and VC9, are native to Win 7 along with .Net3.5.
Only VC10 are new and included in .Net4.0.

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 12:17 pm
by bphlpt
OK ...

So we no longer need to add ANY of the following?

AutoItX3 Runtime
Intel Math Library
KiXtart Runtimes
Microsoft C/C++ 7 Runtimes
Microsoft Visual Basic (versions 1 - 6) Runtimes
OpenAL Runtimes
OpenSSL Runtimes
Python Software Foundation Python Core
Ruby Interpreter
cygwin
zlib
Microsoft CAPICOM
Microsoft Silverlight
Microsoft MSXML (any version)
DirectX

ie NOTHING out of either Kel's Runtimes 6.8 or RogueSpear's Runtimes 4.0.1 applies to Win7???

Seems WAY too good to be true!

Cheers and Regards

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 12:52 pm
by jaynbe
Those are not included because no MS origin:

AutoItX3 Runtime
Intel Math Library
KiXtart Runtimes
OpenAL Runtimes
OpenSSL Runtimes
Python Software Foundation Python Core
Ruby Interpreter
cygwin
zlib


Microsoft optional also not included:

Microsoft Silverlight
Microsoft Visual Basic (v1 - 6) Runtimes
Microsoft C/C++ 7 Runtimes (before 2005)


Microsoft natively included:

Microsoft CAPICOM
Microsoft MSXML (any version)
Microsoft VC8 - 9 Runtimes
DirectX

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 2:28 pm
by bphlpt
I appologize, jaynbe. I have not made myself clear,

I'm talking about Runtime packs like Rel's and RogueSpear's that are not limited to what is required or to just what is available from Microsoft. As I understand the purpose of the packs I mentioned previously, they serve to update components that are included in the OS itself, add useful optional components not included by default, and add additional functionallity through 3rd party free programs.

Have you looked at Kel's and RogueSpear's Runtimes packs? I'm just surprised that I've not seen such a pack to date intended for use in Win7.

Yes, I realize that all those things are readily available separately, and most, but not all, can be used in Win7. But the purpose of a pack would be to make these commonly used components easier to install, ie all at once. You might not have realized it, but RogueSpear's pack can be applied to update a live system, (as can Kel's with a little work), so it would seem that this kind of pack still has use in Win7, or am I wrong? If so, please explain - I really would like to understand. As I said, I'm just starting to play with Win7.

Cheers and Regards

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2010 2:52 pm
by jaynbe
Ok , a complete pack as those made for win XP would not be fully compatible.

Example: DirectX for XP is limited to DX9c as for win 7 it goes DX11.
Also the C++ VC8 and VC9 are natively up to date; same for MSXML

As Microsoft states some of their older runtimes are obsolete and may not
be supported in win 7. I must admit up to now I didn't need any runtimes
other than those provided (exept for Silverlight and recent dotNet updates)

You will have to try and see if the others won't give any issues.

Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:47 am
by Kelsenellenelvian
I could make a basic runtimes, but I am on x64 mainly now so a x86 addon would be VERY untested...

Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:31 pm
by pegasus
@Kel - Please make one addon on x64 Win7 & I'll test it for you.

Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 4:20 pm
by bphlpt
Hi Kel!

That would really be great if you could put a Runtime pack together!

To everyone's great surprise (Heh, Heh - NOT!) I'll confess that I've always been the type to want it all, or at least the option for it. But, I also confess I only know a little about the various Runtime packs, and even less about Win7 and which pieces are appropriate for a Win7 Runtime pack. That being said, what I THINK could be included in an complete pack, using your's and RougueSpear's with DumpyDooby's mod's as examples/models, noting what MU/WU has offered to me, (I'm running Ultimate), and doing a LOT of reading is:

Microsoft .NET 2.0 - 3.5 Updates - Or whatever is natively installed (Any that apply to XP SHOULD apply to Win7, too, I think?)
Microsoft .NET 4.0
Microsoft DirectX - Including DirectX for Managed Code
Microsoft C/C++ Runtimes (Up to and including 2010) and any updates
Microsoft F# 2010 2.0
Microsoft VB Runtimes
Microsoft Silverlight
Microsoft Capicom (WU has pushed KB931906 at me)
Microsoft msxml3 and msxml6 Updates - if any
Microsoft msxml4 - not included by default in Win7, but MS lists msxml4 SP2 KB973688, and msxml4 SP3 KB973685 as valid for Win7
Microsoft Windows6.1-KB917607 - Not really a runtime, but required in Win7 to use the old style help files
AutoItX3 Runtime
Intel Math Library
KiXtart Runtimes
OpenAL Runtimes
OpenSSL Runtimes
Python Software Foundation Python Core
Ruby Interpreter
cygwin
zlib
SPTDinst v1.69
And anything else I missed from your or RougueSpear's pack or anything else you think is appropriate.

NOT - J# 2.0 - No longer supported with .NET 4.0 and VS2010
MAYBE - SAPI51 or TTSEngine - I THINK they are included natively and I THINK they're up to date
MAYBE - some of the other TTS Engines available for XP - L&H and CMU?? Just a wild idea - probably wouldn't even run, haven't investigated, just a harebrained thought. But then again, Lexicon and SR are included by default, so maybe? Like I said, I haven't really looked into it.

Yes, I'm aware that several of the things I mentioned are available separately already from some very fine addon makers - like user_hidden, but it's always nice to have it all rolled up into one pack, even if those separate programs are simply included inside the pack.

I'm only able to use x86 32bit and English only is fine for me, and I REALLY hope you can make it as a Multimode or Switchless Installer so it can be used both at install time and to update a live system, like both your CPL Pack and Uber Pack are able to do.

Anyway, that's my dream for a install of Win7 - include this kind of pack, your CPL and Uber packs, a REG tweak file and a very few essentials, like Firefox, etc, and I'm really ready to go. And if the 3 packs are all able to be run on a live system it'll be easy to keep up to date.

Thanks for your consideration and for all the work you do. We don't thank you enough - but I try. Look forward to hearing your thoughts soon.

Cheers and Regards

Edit - Added mention of DirectX for managed code, SPTDinst, and comments about speech engines.